Q: "Tell us about the origin of Oriental dance 'props.'"

M: People will do things to be different, they will do things to show off, and sometimes there is a real meaning. Sword Dance, "Raks es-Sayf ": it disappeared but there was time when [it was performed], and you can see [sword dancing] in some of the Orientalist paintings from that era. And they still do a dance called "..........." which means "honor," where they brandish the sword at arm's length and try to get the blade to shiver. That's not easy. And, in fact, in Magda Saleh's film "Egypt Dances" you see the last guy in Egypt who could do this -- and he's been dead for quite a while. In Saudi Arabia they do a dance with a sword. What happens to the men's dances is rifles replace the sword.

You have a lot of Moroccan dances where they are brandishing rifles - it's a current weapon of choice! I have this fantasy that 20 years from now they'll be doing the same dance, but instead of brandishing rifles they will be brandishing shoulder-held missile launchers. You know, this testosterone-fuelled [....can't understand the word....]! Like with the cane dance, where men have a "tahtib" - it's a martial art - it's a skill, a game, to some hot music. They use an "assa," which is a big stick, like in Irish "shillelagh," or the Japanese art of Jodo. The women would take the stick and balance it, and say "Look, I can take what you use to hit each other with, and I can use it to show you how cute I am, and I'm not gonna hurt anyone with it!" Same thing with the sword: "Look what I can do!"

And, actually, still today there are dances among the Bedou, where at specific celebrations the woman will take a man's sword and dance with it on her head. There was an African Bedouin tribe (Bedouins, not the Berbers), where a woman would hold the sword against her head and whirl with it, not balance, just whirl and do undulating moves with it. And I have a postcard, the photo taken in the 50s of twin Tunisians dancing with swords on their heads, wearing the Tunisian meleas, wrap-around dresses held with big fibulae and a belt. So when someone says they were the first to do a sword dance - maybe in a particular area of California, at a particular time, but I saw swords dances before I saw Oriental dance.

There were people in New York in the early 60s -- a couple people dancing with a sword - they were Americans, looking for gimmick. The candelabrum was invented by Zouba al Klobbatiya in the early teens of the 1900s. The "klobb" is a lamp, or a lantern. She came out at a wedding during a zeffa procession with a big oil lamp balanced on her head. After her people started doing this with candelabra: Shafiya El Koptia (she was Coptic) was one of the first to use an actual candelabrum. It became a tradition for Zeffa, the wedding procession, where a dancer comes out with the bride and the groom, and then dances for the crowd

Q: When did they come up with a crown-like (helmet) candelabrum design?

M: When dance companies started doing it for stage and had multiples, and wanted them to stay where they belonged and they didn't have as much time to learn how to really balance. But in one of my videos [ ] you can a couple of women who were dancing with real candelabra. You get one that has a good balance, and you can balance it, in the same way you balance a sword or a cane, especially if it has some decent weight to it. It just takes more practice.

Q: What about tray with candles?

M: That's Moroccan. It's real - Raks Al Senniyya.It can be a man or a woman, and it's usually with a tea service - mint tea, with a pot, and glasses and candles. Making and serving mint tea is a wonderful gesture of hospitality, and people will dance with what they use. I've seen people dance with 3 tray on top of each other, doing acrobatics and rolling on the floor, but they wold take much longer time to do it. Just candles, nah. That's kind of a combo with candelabrum.

Q: And what about dancing with a veil? Veil sounds Oriental. M

: American fantasy. Veil is what they use to cover with, not dance with it. It's not peekaboo-I-see-you. They'd be in deep doodoo if they did that.

Q: But Egyptian dancers do come out with a veil. M: That started with Samia Gamal. Samia Gamal was taking ballet classes from Madam Ivanova, who was teaching King Farouk's daughters. Samia was King Farouk's favorite dancer. She wanted to know what to do with her arms: sometimes she would come out and forget what to do with her arms. So Madam Ivanova said: come out with a veil, it will make you keep your arms up, and also in some of the Caucasian (Kavkaz) dances dancers hold the veils that come from their hats and flow behind them, especially in Georgian dances (where you are floating like you are on wheels!) She knew of this tradition from having seen it in the dances of the Caucasus. So, Samia came out with a veil. But the whole idea of "veilwork"?... Mind you, I've seen some veilwork that is so beautiful, it's made me cry, and then you see some people do double veil - it's a beautiful skill! But WE invented.

Americans started getting into the field in the ethnic clubs in the 60s and the early 70s. They didn't have enough of a repertoire of steps to be able to dance half and hour, 45 minutes. They needed something else "to do." Okay - the dance of the 7 veils! - another fantasy. Oscar Wilde in "Salome," and then Richard Strauss' opera based on Oscar Wilde's "Salome." There is no dance of 7 veils mentioned in the Bible. Although there is a real good movie with Rita Hayworth as Salome, and she did a nice dance of 7 veils, but that was fantasy, fantasy, fantasy. Veilwork become a semi-standard , and the reason I stopped doing veilwork, it takes a lot of space, and when you dance in nightclubs, and you come out, there is hardly any space between the tables; you've got a beautiful silk veil, and next thing you know it's got someone else's baba ganoush on it, and it gets caught...And also I'd rather...DANCE! But it's a wonderful American invention. There is a lot of wonderful American inventions!